If those delegates aren't seated somehow, Barack won't win Florida or Michigan in the general anyway. They'll just protest the DCN by staying home - Clinton backers - which is already an idea being floated. People act as is if Barack can win the Presidency w/o Clinton supporters coming into the fold. Please know that he CAN'T. It is mathematical impossibility. There aren't enough independents or left leaning repubs to propel him into the white house.

But why should those seats be counted when those states didn't abide by the rules? And no one campaigned there but Senator Clinton? And why would Clinton supporters do such a thing to the Democratic candidate if Barack pulls this thing out? And since Barack has a very strong backing, what do you think Obama supporters will do if those delegates are seated? And yes, he has a very strong backing. Imagine if the shoe was on the other foot- people would be screaming from the rooftops at how wrong he would be. Like it was said, everything was all good when Barack was in a rehearsal dress- someone's words a few months back ;-)…now that he is a viable candidate, it seems like some people are shaking in their boots. I remember everyone saying that it wasn't his time and that's why they were rockin with Clinton…well, he's shown it's his time…run with us, run from us, or get ran over. Lol

Sorry to disagree with you Lauren, but I live in Florida, I voted and IT SUCKS AZZ to feel that despite that I exercized my right, it's not going to do any good anyway. It's very disheartening - because the issue was that MI & FL state legislature moved up the primaries NOT the Democratic party, yet we, the voters, are made to pay the price because Howard Dean says so.

THAT IS BULL KAKA.

I'm used to voter surpression moves from the Republican Party, but not from my own party.

There is one way they can be seated, give Barack and Hillary 50% of the Florida and Michigan delegates and voters, so they are seated but they cannot skew the legal results.

Presently, in order for Hillary to take the lead again she will have to win the three big States by a 60+% margin, but if Obama wins even one she will not be able to regain the lead, even with the "SuperDelegates" she presently has.
It's not impossible for Hillary but, it is difficult to overcome.

**dress rehearsal, excuse me**

blkmale - I didn't say seat them for Hillary. I said seat them period. They have to be be represented somehow. Hillary didn't campaign in either state BTW.

I said he's in a dress rehersal. And if you think I'm shaking in my boots then you don't know me very well. Why would a Hillary loss scare me? Al lost, Kerry lost, shit…Obama could lose in the GE. Politics does not scare me. I'm disappointed, yes, but not scared.

Or maybe revote? Nah. That's a waste of time and money I guess at this point.

When I read about Chairman Bond's comments, I was outraged and I am an NAACP Branch President.

So I picked up my phone and started calling members of the board and staff to try and understand what in the world was going on. Now to be clear, I am not speaking on behalf of Chairman Bond or anyone else, but I will share with you what I was told.

The position Bond espoused was not that the delegations should be seated in accordance with the results of the 'primaries'. But rather the people of Michigan and Florida should be given some opportunity to vote and indicate their choice, whether that be through a new primary or caucus or some other means. Bond did not talk about what methods would be used, but from what I have heard, his intent was to push the DNC chair to take some kind of action to resolve this prior to the convention.

Since they had been stripped by the DNC, technically no election took place in either State. Bond's push was that some mechanism be selected for determining the will of the residents of MI and FL.

As the facts have come out Julian Bond, sent a letter to the DNC on NAACP letterhead without the knowledge of the NAACP board, and he knows that the DNC Certification committee isn't due to be convened until later this year and they will then make a determination.
So, in all, he was trying to interfere with the process, and mis-representing the NAACP.

First, It's unfair to those individuals who voted in those primaries not to seat those delegates. Second, the children of the corn, my bad, Obama's rabid supporters, know good and damn well if he had won those states they would demand those delegates be seated.

As one of the "children of the corn", I say if Obama was the one asking for the FL, MI delegates to be seated, i would say, Mr Obama you're WRONG!!!
It's all about fair play, for all Black or Woman.

Did you know that only Hillary's name was on the Ballots for Michigan, in Florida the Clintons are well known Barack was not able to introduce himself to Floridians, because he tried to obey the rules.

^^People in Florida know who Barack is. Why do people keep saying that they don't??? Florida is a major media market. If that's your argument then explain how he won all of those smaller white states on Super Tuesday?

Just admit Floridians didn's choose Obama, ok. Just like I have to admit that people in other states didn't vote for Hillary.

*didn't*

You don't get to know someone from the television Blackmistressdiva…..you think people know black folks from rap videos? You truly to get to know someone when you meet them, see them face to face, hear their words in public. So no, the people of Florida don't truly know Barack. Also in post #6 you are mistaken as Hillary DID campaign in Florida.

The states broke the rules, as a result they are out….enough said….problem solved! If they didn't want to be disenfranchised it was very simple….DON'T BREAK THE RULES!

I'm so sick of the bullshit from Obamas' kool aid drinking pawns/supporters. The people in Florida knew and know exactly who Barack Obama is, and do not have to see him one of his live shows to get him.

Here's a bit of info:

MOST AMERICANS NEVER SEE THE PERSON THEY VOTE FOR IN THE FLESH!

Try a new argument.

The Michagan primary needs a do over, or caucus. Whichever is cheaper.
Hillary won the Florida primary, but to be fair the process, the delegates should be evenly split.

To not recognize millions of votes in two major states will not look good for the dems in november, and Barack in particular.

Anyone who thinks Barack would'nt be calling for those Florida delegates to be seated if he had won, has shit for brains, or is just full of shit.
The only reason he's not calling for those delegates, is because he lost big.

This is a delegate race at this point, and every one will count in the end.

Nice rant solitaire I am glad you got that off your chest.

You seem to be saying that Obama supporters are wrong for not wanting these votes to be counted, again the FACT remains if they wanted their votes to count all they had to do was not break the rules! You used three words beautifully in your post "to be fair" my thoughs exactly….in any situation of judgement, if you break the rules you don't get rewarded….sounds fair to me.

Throw away your rants, throw away your opinions that fact of THIS matter remains and is very simple

The main problem with even considering the votes in either of those states is that most people did not go out and vote because they knew beforehand that the delegates were not going to be counted. This is evidenced by the low voter turnout in those two states relative to the record voter turn out in all other states for the Democratic party. If you are going to count those delegates there must be another primary or Caucus so that everyone comes out to vote when they know their delegates will count.

It is pretty dissappointing how so many "black leaders" are using underhanded tricks and schemes against Obama. I guess it is easy to say being used as pawns, but I really can't see it any other way. If Chairman Bond was truly worried about the rights of the voters of Michigan and Florida than his battle should have been front and center for the last 10 months when the rules were announced. For anyone to pretend that his letter being sent to the DNC after Obama has taken the lead is a mere coincidence is lying to themselves. It will be funny to see how all of the "leaders" act towards Obama when he is elected President.

Michigan just seems hellbent on pissing off people and digging a bigger grave for the state. Why they deemed it necessary to push the primaries up to the 15th is beyond me. Especially if it meant that we'd lose out on something bigger. Dumb.

well, why wouldn't the governor of florida intervene if he saw that the legislature was about to pass a law that could jeapordize thousands of democrats' votes….oh, wait.

don't get mad now. where was the concern when the legislature was changing the primary date?

gimme a break.

Florida and Michigan had a choice early on. They could have waited and run their primaries at the previously scheduled time period. Then there would have been no problem registering all the votes. The willingly made the choice to disenfranchise all their voters. If anything, the residents of those states should be going after their own party leaders.
They agreed to the rules, so now must abide by their agreement if there is to be an honorable solution. If they want to be liver lillied about it now, then do an equal split of delegates and shut everyone up once and for all.

Brian, you hit it right on the money. Voters in MI and FL knew that their "votes" would not result in delegates and that fact kept people from the polls. They knew that their vote was essentially a waste of time. Would you take the time to go vote if you knew for a fact that it wouldn't make one iota of difference? Trying to go back and change the rules now and have delegates seated from those states would be very very unfair.

MI and FL politicians knew what the consequences of their actions would be when they moved their primaries up without DNC approval. Voters should be mad at the idiots they elected there. Those are the people who basically decided to disenfranchise their constituents. These states want to be the new Iowa or the new New Hampshire and have more influence in the primaries and then they end up being a useless footnote.

Ditto to everything that No. 18 Brian said.

Also, if the DNC caves and doesn’t uphold its established penalty for states moving up their primaries, then it will lose all credibility and influence in the future when other states follow suite and move up their primaries. It’s the wrong precedent to set.

If people had a problem, then they should have been protesting months ago when the FL and MI legislatures moved up their dates, not now, well into the election.

Backstage - I hear you, but only a handful (percentage wise) of voters ever see a candidate in the flesh. Do you think everyone in a state as big as California (where I live) who voted for Barack saw him live? Or saw Hillary for that matter? Do you think everyone in Florida would have seen in live? The vast, vast majority of people would have seen him on TV. There's nothing wrong with that.

Julian Bond's (and Mary Frances Henderson and Wade Berry) public outcry on behalf of disenfranchised voters is a day late and a dollar short. Why now? Moreover, if Henderson and Berry assisted in writing the letter to the DNC together with Mr. Bond, why did they not sign it with him? Why hide in the shadows if this is indeed a sincere effort to bring about justice and equality for Florida and Michigan voters? Why did these three individuals feel it necessary to come out without the full knowledge, and more importantly, the full support, of the NAACP Board and the organizations that they head. Doing so surely would have had a greater impact and, were it done in a timely manner when the battle was at hand.

Quite frankly, Mr. Bond's public outcry on behalf of all the disenfranchised voters is so far after the battle, it is disingenuous and embarrassing, at best.

This is exactly the kind of politics that folks all across America are demanding a departure from. This is why one hears over and over again, "We Want Change! Change that We Can Believe In!"

Further, this begs the question: If Florida and Michigan voters were allowed to go first, would their voters — the people not the party leaders — be any better off than if they stuck with the party rules? What is in it for the people — the orange grove pickers, the working folks, the service industry employees, the school bus drivers, the firemen, the policemen, the garbage collectors, the teachers? What do they get out of all of this? Is this going to increase their wages, improve their living conditions and provide them with decent health care? No. It is just politics as usual.

As for Hillary Clinton — first we had hanging chads, now we have illegal delegate gathering. Sen. Clinton's statement saying that she was going to do everything she can to get Florida and Michigan delegates seated — but without a new primary — speaks well of her campaign tactics to date.

DNC Chairman Dean's offer of a new primary is, under these circumstances, fair and equitable. If Sen. Clinton is so concerned with the people being disenfranchised, she would have jumped at this opportunity. Instead, she wrongfully claims that she won these two contests. What contests? In the case of Michigan, we all know that she was the only candidate on the ballot — that's not a contest, that's stealing delegates. It is obvious that Sen. Clinton is not in tune with the people she so desperately is trying to become Commander in Chief of. People want change from this kind of politics.

There is an old saying that if you want to know the true nature of a person, watch what they do when faced with seemingly insurmountable obstacles. To date, when faced with seemingly insurmountable obstacles, Sen. Clinton has either cried or stretched the truth into something that is not recognizable as anything of truth or value.

This is exactly why people all across this nation are voting for change that they can believe in. I am confident that given the opportunity, the people of Florida and Michigan will also vote for change that they too can believe in — and not just on a national level.

We don't need the political bosses shoving their puppet (Obama or Hillary) down our throats. The super delegates do not represent the will of the American people. But I am from Michigan and I have a real issue with how everyone is treating us. No one is reporting the truth about the delegates.

Here is the real issue with the Michigan delegates. It was the candidate’s choice, including Obama, to be removed from the ballot. The media hasn’t covered this and has been acting like Obama was excluded from the ballot in Michigan, This is simply not true.

Hillary decided to remain on the ballot. It was a bold move not to bend to the political bosses in Washington like Obama did.

The truth is that the Democratic Party and what they did to Michigan’s delegates is ILLEGAL. It is unconstitutional to deny a personals or a particular group’s (Michigan) right to vote and refuse the results of that vote. Michigan’s delegates legally have to be accounted for in the nomination process.

As I stated previously Obama decided to have his name removed from the ballot in Michigan last fall. When he did that, he relinquished all rights of being chosen as a presidential candidate in the State of Michigan.

The suggestion of a re-vote is absurd, because everyone in the State of Michigan overwhelmingly chose Hillary. It is also absurd because we don’t have the money to pay for it. Michigan has the worst economy in the United States. Outside of Wayne County and high population areas, essential services are basically cut off from all state funding. Michigan can't even support it's own watered down Mental Health Code, Schools are barely funded, and correctional institutions are being shutdown. We can't even maintain our roads. We don't have funding for salting icy and hazardous roads, It takes up to three weeks to have the ice removed from the highway.

The reason Michigan moved up its primary is that it is a larger state and has been treated like it is not even a part of the United States. As soon as we are at our worst and try to get up, the Political Bosses decide to kick us when we are down.